Newbie 1041 - So Cold Newbies (OVER!)

[Escho]

Hi everyone! Hope we have a fun game.

My answers:
1. I think both have qualities which make them equally likable, town trying to find out the mafia and the mafia attempting to hide their identity make both roles fun for me.
2. I don't think lynching all liars should be the case as it can be part of a strategy in order to find the mafia, hence the game gets more interesting.
3. Lynch the lurkers when there are no suspicious targets.

I'll

Vote: yuri-chi

just because he hasn't posted anything yet

[Escho]

Hi everyone! Hope we have a fun game.

My answers:
1. I think both have qualities which make them equally likable, town trying to find out the mafia and the mafia attempting to hide their identity make both roles fun for me.
2. I don't think lynching all liars should be the case as it can be part of a strategy in order to find the mafia, hence the game gets more interesting.
3. Lynch the lurkers when there are no suspicious targets.

I'll

Vote: yuri-chi

just because he hasn't posted anything yet

Oops seems like I have made a typo,

UnVote: yuri-chi

since that player doesn't even exist and

Vote: yura-chi

of course for the same reasons.

[Escho]

An interesting comment. Can you give one situation when lying can be used to find mafia. More often, lying costs the town. (e.g. claiming a power role as VT). Remember that this is a newbie game, the only power roles we could have is a Doctor or a Cop.

Perhaps as a townie you could falsely state that you are a cop in order to confuse the mafia and increase the chance of the mafia making a mistake and killing the townie rather than the cop. It is also likely that the mafia will claim to be a townie to cover their identity rather than a specific job such as a doctor or a cop. The lying from a townie would be especially beneficial if the cop has happened to check the role of the falsely claiming townie before and it would provide the cop a shield while he goes on checking someone else who may be the mafia. But I do see the problem that it could backfire and confuse the town instead, and also the fact that the lying would not work if there is no cop but a doctor instead. I acknowledge this fact and take back what I have said.

[Escho]

Wow the game surely progressed rapidly while I was away.
@CrazyQuestions from what I see the vote from tylerjarvis seems to me a purely random one. I see that your making connections and trying to fin d flaws but personally I think it is too early a stage for that. It seems your connections are somewhat forced and inconvincing, and due to this I feel as though you are putting yourself in jeopardy. I cannot find any suspicious reasons behind tylerjarvis' random vote against Kadersalad.
On that note, could we use more simplistic English, not everyone here is a native speaker and I do find it hard to keep up with the game unless I have a dictionary right next to me :p

Also,

UnVote: yura-chi

as he is out of the game.

[Escho]

The good reason I had to vote was that I want out of RVS.
If there's a way to do that without lynching anyone, let's do it that way.
I was convinced otherwise, so I arbitrarily picked Salad. The way I understand this game is that the person with the most votes at the end of the day gets lynched. At least, that's how I've always understood Mafia. I picked someone for no real reason other than the fact that I was convinced it would be best. I'm still more than willing to change my vote if other evidence shows up, but as its the first day, I don't honestly expect it to.
I was under the impression that a tie was the only thing to prevent a lynching, but then there was all this talk about L-1 and L-3, which I have no earthly idea what it means.

To ANYONE WHO AGREES WITH THAT VIEW:

Do you consider his final explanation on a total random vote popped out by reasons that are no longer available to his mind a lie? How is that connected to your answer on the "lynch all liars" question?

Just here, you have compiled what tylerjarvis has previously stated and you are suggesting that he is perhaps lying, and thus should be lynched? From what I understand he has voted just for the sake of voting, and here explains that he has taken no serious consideration to who he has voted for nor much thinking into his voting. By compiling this perhaps you were trying to suggest us that he is lying but since I cannot see any flaws or any misleading statements which leads me to see him suspicious, I cannot but feel as though you are "forcing" your way into the argument. Like I have stated before perhaps that should be left until the game has progressed furthur and we are left with more information. This is only Day 1 and I believe you are too quick in accusing someone of being a liar.

[Escho]

Btw just a newbie question, since I have unvoted yura-chi as she left, must I place a vote on someone else? If so can it still be a random one?

[Escho]

also

eg

lets say u voted for tyler and he becomes an easy target while i try to persuade people to accuse kadersalad and suddenly change my lynching vote to tyler, immediately this reactions reveals that i want to kill tyler as he is an easy target as mafias want to kill people as soon as they can

I agree with what aaah has stated above. From my experience, mafias would attempt to lynch someone who they think is the weakest and tend to change their actions very quickly. Consequently, their motives behind the vote are somewhat insignificant.

I unable to read anything through your ranting, we can't have someone forcing her every opinion, and you have taken us nowhere.

I do understand that CrazyQuestion's "ranting" has provided us with minimal information but to vote her just for that seems to me a big risk. In the game of mafia, to lose fellow townies can be fatal for the town as obviously it increases the chance of mafias winning. Taking to the risk to lose a fellow townie just because he or she may be annoying is just something I cannot understand.

Not only this, kadersalad has stated,

Vote: tylerjarvis

for becoming suspicious

but then later claimed that he could not find any suspicious points about tylerjarvis when he never questioned him deeply, it was more of Crazyquestion's rant that was subjected at tylerjarvis (which as kadersalad has stated himself, provides us with no directions and this tells us that if kadersalad was actually suspicious of tylerjarvis, he should have questioned him further).

This leads me to

Vote: Kadersalad

as I am becoming suspicious of him for changing his votes so haphazardly and I see no benefit which his vote can bring the town (as annoying as crazyquestions can be, she is still trying to find clues which will at the least not harm the town at all).

[Escho]

What's the mod talking about? I'm a bit confused

[Escho]

@moose200x
What's wrong with you o.o

[Escho]

Escho wrote:
I do understand that CrazyQuestion's "ranting" has provided us with minimal information but to vote her just for that seems to me a big risk.


That sounded to me a bit odd. Might you tell me who has actively provided you with useful information in this game? Otherwise, you are "negatively" labelling a player...and again, it seems you are using the results of my actions (kader reaction) to place your vote...is it minimal or is it not?

No offence, but it wasn't your actions which brought out the findings I used in order to vote Kadersalad. You didn't target him directly in your posts and naturally it wasn't you who led me to vote for kadersalad. Unless you were trying to be annoying and leading players vote on you on purpose I still see your actions minimal. As for your first questions, it was Kadersalad himself who provided the information I needed to vote on him.

Escho wrote:
In the game of mafia, to lose fellow townies can be fatal for the town as obviously it increases the chance of mafias winning. Taking to the risk to lose a fellow townie just because he or she may be annoying is just something I cannot understand.


That sounds like you truly know I am a townie...not good for my view of you.

No, I am not labelling you as a townie because that was a general statement I made to prove my point. Hopefully you can see that I started off on a general sense saying "in the game of mafia" which implies I wasn't talking about the specific one we are playing at the moment but any game of mafia. Read it again and you might see that I wasn't labelling anyone as a townie.

[Escho]

Ok there's too many information I have to catch up on.
I'm just gonna say I'm suspecting Kadersalad (for the reason i have previously stated), Tylerjarvis for his vote-hopping just like Kadersalad, DemonHybrid because he is obviously helping Tylerjarvis so much (perhaps a really friendly IC but i dont think we should trust someone so fully in mafia when we dont know what others' roles are) and moose200x due to the lack of involvement and random comments. Well these are the people i will have my eyes on. TBH, I still think Kadersalad is the most suspicious one of the 4 i have listed.

Also, CrazyQuestions, explain to me how my behaviour is a scummy one in a compact format. You have too much "analysis" that i cannot find it.

[Escho]

Man it feels like the game is being dragged on. Are normal days usually this long, I'm already getting tired of how the game hasn't progressed at all. CrazyQuestions just calm down and stop making blimmin long as posts which no one wants to read. Can't you make it shorter so that it's easier on the readers - your so called analysis would be more helpful if it was concise, we are not on the forum to write essays you know.

[Escho]

1. If we were buddying, you did know that town buddies, and far more often than scum does because scum likes to distance themselves from each other, right? Yes, scum buddies too, but not as often as people think.

2. I am defending tyler from crappy attacks and tyler is ATTACKING me instead. You know that means it isn't mutual, but an independent action on my part, right?

For the first point, we are in a newbie game so perhaps you are taking an advantage of the fact that we are inexperienced? And I was wondering, why are you so certain that tylerjarvis is a townie? Isn't it basic mafia knowledge that no one should be trusted...you are talking as if you know that Tyler is a townie, due to the over-protection you show everyone.

And on the second point, why do you not respond to tylerjavis' "attack"? Isn't it more normal to show someone, especially if you believe they are townie that you are on the same side as him? Just by protecting him you are not showing whether you are townie or not, but just portraying that you want to be on tylers' side :/

Oh and just one other point, I do agree with the fact that and Tylerjarvis is vote-hopping too much, I understand that your minds can alter during the course of the game I believe it's more normal for townies to stick by their first choice - since they would have a specific reason for voting in the first place - or at least not vote hop without a strong case that you have built for yourself, not adopting someone elses' "analysis" without puttin much of your own opinion into it.

[Escho]

1. If we were buddying, you did know that town buddies, and far more often than scum does because scum likes to distance themselves from each other, right? Yes, scum buddies too, but not as often as people think.

2. I am defending tyler from crappy attacks and tyler is ATTACKING me instead. You know that means it isn't mutual, but an independent action on my part, right?

For the first point, we are in a newbie game so perhaps you are taking an advantage of the fact that we are inexperienced? And I was wondering, why are you so certain that tylerjarvis is a townie? Isn't it basic mafia knowledge that no one should be trusted...you are talking as if you know that Tyler is a townie, due to the over-protection you show everyone.

And on the second point, why do you not respond to tylerjavis' "attack"? Isn't it more normal to show someone, especially if you believe they are townie that you are on the same side as him? Just by protecting him you are not showing whether you are townie or not, but just portraying that you want to be on tylers' side :/

Oh and just one other point, I do agree with the fact that and Tylerjarvis is vote-hopping too much, I understand that your minds can alter during the course of the game I believe it's more normal for townies to stick by their first choice - since they would have a specific reason for voting in the first place - or at least not vote hop without a strong case that you have built for yourself, not adopting someone elses' "analysis" without puttin much of your own opinion into it.

Oh I forgot to writer Kadersalad and tylerjarvis

[Escho]

http://mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.ph ... 6#p2684406

This is my past PBPA on tyler's play up to that post. It's not complete, but a lot of the interactions have been repeats of behavior on both sides.

My bad, mustve missed it somehow. Well I just want to ask one thing, if your reason behind voting for kadersalad is due to his frequent vote-hopping how come you don't "attack" tylerjarvis for the same reason? He seems to be vote-hopping as well.

[Escho]

Just a random thing -
Merry Christmas everyone~!

[Escho]

And on the second point, why do you not respond to tylerjavis' "attack"? Isn't it more normal to show someone, especially if you believe they are townie that you are on the same side as him? Just by protecting him you are not showing whether you are townie or not, but just portraying that you want to be on tylers' side :/

I found this point very interesting. I would like to see your analysis on this issue, escho, as I have not a clear view and I am suspecting Demon from a different angle. Might you tell us:

a) which are your signals/posts/reasons/intuitions to think that Demon is responding other players but not tylerjarvis?
b) if you convince us of a), might you tell us why this could be the case? I guess aaah400 especially will like to read in more detail some theory about why this is happening, or provide one.

---

Once you answer that, and from a different angle, I would like to know why you feel so comfortable voting for salad thinking at the same time that demon might be using you to lynch salad...

a) I don't remember seeing Demon defend his case when tyler has "attacked" him. He even said that tyler was attacking him yet he was still defending tyler because he thinks he's a townie. This is different to how he reacted to players such as yourself or aaah, where he has tried to convince us of the fact that he is townie.
b) If you are convinced, I have no idea why you would do what Demon has done which is why I asked him in the first place.

I don't feel like Demon is using me to lynch kader....what makes you think he's using me? I believe I provided my own reasons behind voting for him, and that reason still remains valid because kader is still vote-hopping.

[Escho]

What's your thoughts on kadersalad nacho? I'd like to know :p

[Escho]

You know, Escho, I'd kinda like to hear a few of your opinions on other people. You're staying awfully quiet.

Well I express my thoughts when necessary, and I just want to know what nacho thinks of laser because I'm still suspicious of him.

[Escho]

I mean kadersalad :p Stupid auto correct

[Escho]

I'm actually in Bali atm, lucky they have wifi.

[Escho]

Sorry for the lack of contribution, I was travelling overseas (actually still am) and didn't get the chance to go on the computer much.

@Kader: I am suspicious of you the most and you probably know why. I am starting to consider aaah as it seems that's what everyone else is considering.

@Aaa:

kadersalad wrote:
I am curious Escho, do you have any other suspicions for anyone else.
What about you Ibarra, who do you think is scum.

this may indcate that escho and kadersalad are not scum 2gether but one of them maybe scum overall

I don't see how I might be scum because kader has asked this. It seems to me you wish to narrow the search to me and kader but I dont see that behaviour very town - you should consider all others. I'm suspicious why you would narrow down so quickly, this is just what happened in Day 1 where you suddenly narrowed down the search to DemonHybrid and Tylerjarvis.

Will post more when I get the time.

[Escho]

2. How do we 100% know if Nacho is Cop? no body knows if he is cop exactly. and of course he did do the hammer for demonhybrid wen he did say he was going to wait for Ibarra's return

We'll just have to assume that he is, nobody else came out and said they are the cop. And it was established in the beginning of the game that false roleclaim should not happen because it is anti-town - and if this was the case, the real cop should have said something.

4. We can see if Moose is really townie and Nacho is cop if we lynch either one of them. we can see if Nacho is actually cop by Lynching moose or lynching nacho. But since Nacho claimed himself cop, the mafia's will obviously attack the power roles first rather than townies as the Cop can check at night who is mafia,townie etc.

No we shouldn't. Why should we lynch people who are confirmed they are on the town's side? That only leads to the chance of mafias winning higher. I find your suggestion quite scummy...

6. And of course for kadersalad i did provide an ISO about him. AND if i was scum with Kadersalad, y would i even write a long argument showing he is scum in the first place. i provided detailed analysis on kadersalad and it is very relevant.

Yes, I agree that Kadersalad is also showing a very scummy side and I am suspicious of him also. Why you might write long arguments, well, you are allowed to lynch other mafias if you are one in order to cause confusion - say if you lynched kadersalad and he turns out mafia then you would be taken out of consideration by others. Perhaps this could be the plan?

[Escho]

Oh and btw where is the doc pm where I can check the rule change?

[Escho]

oh right, thanks.

I just read it.

[Escho]

i never said town is avoiding NK -o- we were talking about cops :/ wat r u on

The cop is on the town's side =/

[Escho]

Escho: What do you think of what I've written on kadersalad?

I dont know now...I'm sorta unsure of what kader might be. I guess his vote-hopping didn't really end up lynching someone...still, his responses are quite short as if he is trying to hide something.

I dont see y i should be lynched at the moment also, as no information will be gained after my lynch

Must we lynch just for the sake of getting information? We should lynch whoever we think is scum I think because...that's the main aim of the game.

[Escho]

Nacho, I understand that you're way more experienced than me at this, and that you're the cop and everything but I cannot see how Aaah isn't reacting scummy.

I mean, I know you want an Ibarra lynch, but I just can't find how Ibarra has shown himself to be nearly as scummy as Aaah has.

Yeah I agree with tyler, has Ibarra's behaviour been that scummy? I havn't even noticed his "scumminess" until you pointed it out nacho. As for aaah, well he seems like hes somewhat panicking and isn't making a really good comeback, which is probably why hes being portrayed as a mafia. I reckon we have a higher chance of getting scum on aaah than ibarra.

[Escho]

anyhow i did mention about Escho before if u have read properly but i did claim that He mightve NK'ed Crazy due to his long claims as Escho previously in day1 say he didnt like crazy's long posts

LOL WHAT? Just because I found crazy's posts annoying doesn't mean that I would've killed her, I still read all her posts it was just too long...I'm sure most of the people here found her posts the same way =/. And actually you showed similar behaviour here:

and i dont like how CrazyQuestions posts are long too much to read XD!!

Does that make you scummy also?

[Escho]

I want to vote aaah but since "patience is the key" I am waiting...

and my scum list: Kadersalad and Aaah

[Escho]

Has anyone else noticed that the more panicked and upset aaah gets, the worse his spelling, grammar, and general ability to male sense get too?

Haha noticed it a while ago.

[Escho]

I'm still not convinced for some reason...maybe its because aaah hasnt produced a fresh case against anyone yet - all i've seen is just as tyler said, "i'm not innocent" situation from him.

You do have a point there, but as Nacho said, "Why would he even be curious about the differences between Vanilla, Chocolate or Strawberry townie?" I have more reason to believe that the question was an honest one.

Maybe because hes a newbie =/ I would have been curious of whether or not there are different types of townies unless my friend explained the game before I had started.

I'm going to

vote:aaah400

, he is now at

L-1

[Escho]

btw I mean "i'm innocent" not "i'm not innocent" =P

[Escho]

[quote="Ibarra"]6) Escho - null read - Day 1 play is more of follow the crowd. On Day 2 as well. Can you tell me though, why you posted fluff instead of your read on aaah, and only did so when I asked you?quote]

I posted my read on aaah quite a while ago, maybe you should check it.

[Escho]

Wait.
Escho, what exactly were you waiting for when you posted:

I want to vote aaah but since "patience is the key" I am waiting...

I was waiting for nacho's reasons of why aaah isn't scum. I've read it and then read tyler's and I was more convinced by tyler so decided to vote aaah.

[Escho]

Because I normally take my time before voting for someone...I don't just vote randomly without thinking and I like to take my time. Also, it's not like i check the forum everyday...

[Escho]

Vote: Ibarra

[Escho]

Wait up guys going on pc to provide evidence :s

[Escho]

I've noticed that without you guys being noticed you have been helping others out...well at least Ibarra did for you tyler. And also, you guys never actually engage in much action against one another - perhaps you two are a team. Not only this...Ibarra there isn't a single action which I remember you acting out which means that you have been staying out of the spotlight (exactly what nacho pointed out), the lack of contribution only tells me that you are somewhat scummy - most of the time your posts are about explaining things to us newbs which really doesn't help the scum hunting. I've never seen Ibarra go indepth with scum hunting which is why I am suspecting him of being scum

[Escho]

Oh and also, I'm suspicious of why you never had a scum read on anyone as youve stated so in post 643 upto post 665... I mean this only shows you've never took much care in scum hunting - perhaps because your main goal was to survive until the end?

[Escho]

Escho. Unvote.

Why should I? I have my reason to vote him.

[Escho]

Escho. Unvote.

THIS IS MOST SCUM BEHAVIOR EVER

Indicating team play/Both Scum,

Agreed...

[Escho]

Vote: Ibarra

wth...=S

[Escho]

Lol I sucked so bad this game...I bet everyone knew I was scum lol

[Escho]

lol nah it helped me though, the one where you said you should ask the intentions behind people's actions and what kinda questions you should ask youself.

[Escho]

I HELPED =p