Newbie 818 (Game Over)
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Pomegranate Mafia Scum
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Pomegranate Mafia Scum
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Pomegranate Mafia Scum
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Pomegranate Mafia Scum
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Pomegranate Mafia Scum
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I've played a lot in real life. But about a month ago my sister Plum (that's her name on the site) was going to be away for a month or two and asked me if I would join the site and replace in for her in one of her games. I agreed because I had been planning to join the site anyway, and because she had told me a lot about online mafia since she joined the site. Right now I'm still in the game I replaced into for her (it's not a newbie game) as well as in this game.Pablo Molinero wrote:To All: What is your experience with mafia? Have you played much real life/on other sites? Personally, I'm a vet of both, but much prefer this to real life, just because my 'tells' in real life are painfully obvious.-
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Don't worry about playing the game wrong, just think to make sure you're not doing anything stupid.sraymonds wrote:It's me nervously overcompensating because I feel like I'm playing the game wrong.
As such, I'm going to leave my vote and then just sit and observe how everything goes.
You can't just sit and observe. Often that is refered to as lurking. Mafia games don't go well when some people don't participate enough. What you have to do is scumhunt, basically analyzing everyone's behavior and posts. At this point there isn't that much to analyze, but that's why most games start in RVS.
I don't know if that's such a good explanation, but I tried. Everyone should feel free to add to it.-
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Jackinthebox: I'm a bit reluctant to put sraymonds at L-2 considering that he fell under suspicion for doing the same thing. Also, while I am suspicious of him, this is his first game ever, and it could have been a mistake on his part.
I will see how sraymonds acts from here on, and if I find myself in the appropriate situation, I will vote him.-
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I agree with this. I would love to actually scumhunt, but at this point no one's been acting scummy enough to earn my vote. The cases that I have seen on various players are all somewhat feeble; none of them has made me feel like there is someone worth lynching at this point, or that we will have enough info to lynch a player worth lynching by the deadline.Exalt wrote:In my opinion, all cases involved right now are MAJORLY weak. Completely useless in any sort of case on anyone. With this type of information, we mine as well draw straws to see who is getting lynched.
I'll try to reanalyze the 4 pages to see if there is anything worthwhile. I just don't see much content... and a deadline in 2 weeks with only 4 pages of content, and 99% of that being RVS? I think hohum is jumping the gun by far on that one, but whatever.-
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I don't wait for someone to say that they're scum (sorry, it's my fault, I didn't explain myself clearly). I try to contribute to discussion while waiting for someone to make a comment that makes my scumdar tingle. I try to see who has been acting scummy, and I try to see who others think are scummy. By the time the lynch comes around hopefully I will have someone who has been acting scummy enough to deserve my vote.Pablo Molinero wrote:
Wait, are you actually saying we should sit around for someone to come along and go, "So I think we should lynch Pablo, and BY THE WAY I'M SCUM!" Activity, kids, that's how we get info. Use some votes; they're your weapon to pressure. Yes, "wagon" is a dirty word around here, but it's necessary.I agree with this. I would love to actually scumhunt, but at this point no one's been acting scummy enough to earn my vote.
So: would anyone be down with a lurker-lynch at this point?
Oh, and I'm not against lurker-lynch, but I'd like to wait a few more days first.-
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-Katy, do you find anyone other than adamrights scummy? If so, whom?Katy wrote:
NO.Exalt wrote:Are you guys seriously using EMOTICONS as a scum case?
God, for the last time, no. It's not the emoticons. Pablo is the one who said something about emoticons. The emoticons and the jokes combined were a weak case but on closer look I didn't really like what I was seeing.
It was the way his posts seemed to implicate people but throw in a bunch of jokes so that he could later excuse it as "oh, I was just joking."
I admit it's extremely weak, but as you say, there's not much to go on. Generally I'm a cautious player, but on this site I've found you get dinged if you don't pick out concrete suspects, so I'm doing the best I can with pretty meager offerings.
-adamrights, I don't understand your reasoning for being suspicious of Pablo. Could you explain what was fishy about him in clearer terms?
How exactly did you come to that conclusion?adamrights wrote:I guess if Pablo turns out scum then Katy should be the next investigation.
-Jackinthebox, you say you find sraymond to be suspicious, yet you give him a defense in order to avoid suspicion in the future. Why? Pablo asked you why you did this, and you say that the defense won't help him. Then you suspect Pablo for coming to sraymond's aid, and voting for you because you didn't make sense. Is that just OMGUS? If not, why?
-Kitoari, are you going to continue lurking? If not, post some content, and if so, do you need to be replaced (or lynched)?
-Pablo, how suspicious are you of adamrights for his use of emoticons? What do you think of his claim that he's a newbie and he's just getting used to the site?
Do you have other experience as an IC? I'm wondering because, while this game is not going quickly, you seem overly happy with the idea of lurker-lynch, when we still have two weeks to go before deadline.
-Exalt, you are also lurking a bit. Will you post more now that you finals are over?
-sraymonds, I have some questions about this post:
Why do you feel like you're playing the game wrong? This is a newbie game, meant to help newbies learn how to play. If you feel that way because you stirred up discussion, don't. We need something to bring us out of RVS, and you helped bring the game along. It was slightly scummy, but I think it will be mainly gotten over if you look around for scum.sraymonds wrote:It's me nervously overcompensating because I feel like I'm playing the game wrong. As such, I'm going to leave my vote and then just sit and observe how everything goes.
From the second sentence of that post I'm wondering if you're going to start lurking too, in addition t everyone who is lurking now.
@Jackinthebox, hopefully you understood why I'm voting for you from my questions, and if you answer them satisfactorily, then I might rescind my vote.-
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Now I understand your view on lurker-lynching; thanks for clarifying.Pablo wrote:PomegranateDo you have other experience as an IC? I'm wondering because, while this game is not going quickly, you seem overly happy with the idea of lurker-lynch, when we still have two weeks to go before deadline.
Yeah, this is my 3rd or 4th game as an IC, so I enjoy the role a bit. Also, look at my context and phrasing of the lurker-lynch: do you really think I'm behind the idea, or am I just posing a question?-
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I'm sorry, but I don't understand much from that post. Could you please rephrase yourself in a clearer so I will understand it? I'm sorry for making you do this, but I want to get my facts about everybody straight.adamrights wrote:
Post 72 is where I illustrate my suspicions on Pablo.Pomegranate wrote: -adamrights, I don't understand your reasoning for being suspicious of Pablo. Could you explain what was fishy about him in clearer terms?
Kind of in a rush, have to read page 5. Should post more later.-
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Well said, Katy.Katy wrote:Adamrights, you are sounding really defensive, pushing on anyone who shows even a slight amount of suspicion on you. If you are not scum, and are town, then the way to save yourself would be to find some scum.
You seem to believe that anyone who shows even a little bit of suspicion on you is suddenly scummy. Do you have any other evidence on Deep Blue besides his latest post? Right now I'm inclined to dismiss your vote as OMGUS unless you have something else to base it on.-
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I'm not sure if adamrights deserves my vote, but I don't think so. He's been very defensive, which could be a sign of newbie scum, but I think it's just a sign of plain newbieness. Right now I'm not planning to switch my vote, but I might depending on what adam does in the future.Pablo wrote:- Pomegranate, I'm not a fan of your quick "yeah," style post behind Deep Blue and Katy. Again, does adamrights deserve DB's and/or your vote?-
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Actually, MM, when you first asked me if I knew about the theory, adamrightsExalt wrote:
The theory is more like the 3rd and 4th votes are scum, not just the 3rd. The reason for that is that scum neither want to start wagons nor be at the end of them, so they will be in the middle somewhere.MiteyMouse wrote:
There is a common theory that the third voter on a bandwagon is Scum. Thoughts?Pomegranate wrote:
No, I don't think so. But it obviously applies to the situation I created by giving Jackinthebox a third vote.MiteyMouse wrote:Pomagranate...have you ever heard the 3rd vote theory?
Either way, this theory needs evidence to back it up or its useless. You need a case beside the theory and have the theory just be a side note in the case. Without that you are using null tells as evidence.hadunvoted. But I did give Jack his third vote. The reasons that I voted for Jack were stated in post 98, and I did say that if he answered my questions well then I would remove my vote. My vote was basically there to pressure him a bit; it was there to get answers out of him. But he didn't answer my questions. At this point he can't answer them anyway because he's been replaced. Since they won't be answered now, I'llUnvote. But I will keep an eye out for Youdontknow.
Just to clarify, I wasn't trying to be part of a bandwagon, I was trying to get answers out of Jack.-
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Basically, I asked Jack why he gave a possible defense to sraymonds, whom he thought was scummy, then saying that a defense wouldn't do anythingYoudontknow wrote:Vote: Pomegranate
Given what I said in the first part of this post, I guess it is a bit ironic that I am voting for the person who said that they would watch me closely. I am not voting for Pomegranate because she said that, though. The main reason I vote for Pomegranate is the way she acted at the start of the game. Pomegranate did not contribute a lot of substance but was quick to jump on the bandwagon of both sraymonds (37) and Jackinthebox (95). Pomegranate gave little explanation for her suspicion of either player, except for a short and confusing remark to Jackinthebox (98). Pomegranate, if you don’t mind, please clarify why you voted for Jackinthebox. In post 98, it is not obvious to me why he deserved your vote. Are you voting for him because he wrote a response to an attack he created? Are you voting for him because he suspected Pablo after Pablo attacked him? Is it a mix of both? To me, the way that you have largely lurked (many of your posts having nothing to do with finding out who is Townie and who is Mafia) and are quick to jump on players that other people suspect make you scummy, and that is why you are getting my vote at this point in time.
I'm sorry if you don't think I posted a lot of content yet. I'm still feeling my way around, trying to figure out how I play best. I don't see where I jumped on sraymonds' bandwagon; post 37 was me wondering why sraymonds put DB at L-2, and in post 65 I gave him an FoS, but I never voted for him or joined a bandwagon on him.
In post 98 I posted some questions directed toward Jack. The reason I voted for him was because I wanted to put him under a little pressure to answer them. Once he was replaced and he wouldn't be able to answer my questions, I unvoted because pressuring you to answer for him would be useless.
Basically, I asked Jack why he gave sraymonds a defense, then said that the defense wouldn't help sraymonds anyway (why wouldn't it?). Also, after Pablo voted for Jack, Jack voted for Pablo. I was wondering if there was a reason for it, or if it was OMGUS.Pomegranate wrote:Jackinthebox, you say you find sraymond to be suspicious, yet you give him a defense in order to avoid suspicion in the future. Why? Pablo asked you why you did this, and you say that the defense won't help him. Then you suspect Pablo for coming to sraymond's aid, and voting for you because you didn't make sense. Is that just OMGUS? If not, why?
I understand that your vote is not an OMGUS vote. Thanks for explaining yourself.-
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Here I go...
-DB, do you think you could post some content? Your only post over four lines long was your defense after adamrights voted for you.
-Exalt, who are you most suspicious of? You don't seem to have professed any suspicions yet.
-Katy, what other types of methods are you reffering to? What are you talking about as far as "risky propositions", and and what is that reffering to?Eh, a lurker lynch might be a good deterrent in a game without the prod-replace system, but the game offers plenty of other methods to deal with lurkers beyond lynching them, which is always a risky proposition.
-MM, who are you most suspicious of? Also, what do you think of YDK's case against me?
-YDK, I your interrogation of me makes you look townie, but I think it was misdirected. I understand how you came to the conclusion that I lurked, but I think I have contributed as much as say, DB, sraymonds, adamrights, or MM/Kitoari.-
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Actually, right now I'm not very sure what I think of you. I just wanted to clarify youur mistake.adamrights wrote:
That was an accident -- didn't mean to hit submit, but it is interesting to know that your very clear about not voting for me. Perhaps, as scum, you know I'm not and want to make the town-side perceive you as not for lynching a townie.Pomegranate wrote:
Um, I didn't vote for you, Exalt did.adamrights wrote:Pomegranate wrote:
VOTE: Adamrights[/b]
because I want to hear what he has to say about everything, no time for lurking with a deadline in a week.-
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I think that if I am lynched, when I flip town you will say that you were convinced by Miteymouse, Youdontknow, and Exalt, who have all professed to being somewhat suspicious of me so far.adamrights wrote:Some quick thoughts: I definitely think between Exalt, DB and Pom there is a scum. My gut is leaning toward Pom. You've been showing a tendency to question if I'm suspicious lately (sort of like Pablo), which seems like the right tactic to me if your scum, see someone acting suspicious, but know they're town...that way you could come aboard around vote 4 if another person hops on me, and make it like you were convinced by the crowd plus you took a roll of the dice (which I guess we're all doing to some degree). I'm trying to make scum reads off reactions off me...
As for a lurker-lynch vote...I'm not really for it. Whose been lurking lately? Syramonds? You haven't answered my question yet...-
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Possible scumpair: Pablo & Adamrights. Any thought?
Pablo- Exalt said that he is playing differently than he usually does. At the beginning of the game Pablo said he was seriously voting adamrights due to his use of emoticons. Later, in post 100, he said that he isn't suspicious of adam for his use of emoticons at all, not explaining why. Is it possible that they hadn't figured out how to interact as scum yet? Possible, but it could just be me. As suggested previously (I can't remember by whom), Pablo could be asking about lurker-lynch because he doesn't want it to be used on him. I heard what he had to say about a research paper, and if he starts posting more, I'll take that into account. But for now,FoS: Pablo
I don't have time right now to post my suspicions of adam. I will probably be able to this afternoon. I will not have access tonight or tomorrow, although I might on Saturday night or Sunday morning. It's possible I won't though, so I could be V/LA up until Sunday night, but I don't think so.-
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Actually, I'm sure you did notice it before, considering you asked me about it in post 93, right after I posted it. Then we had a discussion about, and you seemed to let it drop. I'm not sure why you're bringing it up again.Pablo wrote: I’m not sure why I didn’t notice it before, but Pom on page 4 is looks very suspect in my opinion. For one, she gives the whole awful:
Pom wrote: I agree with this. I would love to actually scumhunt, but at this point no one's been acting scummy enough to earn my vote.-
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I defended myself in post 146. If you don't understand anything specific about it, please ask my to clarify. Personally I don't see how it's insubstantial, so if there is anything wrong with it, please point it out to me.Youdontknow wrote:That being said, my number one is still Pomegranate. From the beginning her play seemed scummy to me because, as I have mentioned, she provided the game little content but was quick to jump on easy bandwagons. The defense she has provided for herself has not substantial and is usually confusing to me. Even now, when she has two or three people who believe she is scummy, she has not really said anything about the way she has played this game or given an explanation for some of her actions. She has also been hesitant to keep her vote where it is when it is close to lynch, perhaps to avoid suspicion as someone who lynched a Townie. I am also troubled by her attack on Pablo and adam on post 211, talking about emoticons and circumstantial evidence (Exalt’s view of Pablo’s play in a different game). Trying to interact as scum? Sorry, I don’t buy it. As someone who questioned Pablo’s idea of a lurker-lynch, I firmly believe that he has explained why he mentioned it and later said he did not want it. From my perspective, that claim no longer holds any water. For these reasons, Pomegranate still has my vote.
I didn't see where Pablo explained his actions, but I'll reread him in in iso to find his explanation.-
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The speculation was somewhat odd. Kirby seemed pretty sure that we have a mafia roleblocker, while there is only a 50/50 chance that we do. I didn't pick up on it at first, but seeing how adam explained it makes me a bit suspicious. For nowadamrights wrote:Kirb, is there any reason you assumed the scum have a role-blocker and that we have a doctor/cop? What was the point? There really wasn't any...it wasn't just speculation; it was informed speculation.
I'm thinking we might have luckily caught the real scum RB with your slip up. (Would a goon know if his partner is a RB...not until evening in a newbie game, right?)
This makes sense with syramonds going inactive after coming off too suspicious early on. Perhaps he did not want to lose this power role for the mafia...
Unless someone else has some further insight I believe my vote on Kirb is the best bet for the town -- it's a slip-up we have to capitalize on.FoS: Kirby. I want to see how Kirby will continue to act about this.-
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Deadline is Friday.Exalt wrote:When's our deadline? I was gone all yesterday to go to chicago bears training camp... and Friday I'll be gone all day too... I'm going to a cubs game.
So I have today and tomorrow really to post as much as possible and hopefully we can come up with someone before the deadline. I don't want a NL.-
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Some opinions...
adamrights, you are my top suspect. Here's why:
Generally, contradicting oneself is considered scummy. This instance too scummy, but trying to get away with contradicting yourself doesn't make you look townie.adamrights wrote:Katy wrote:
So looking back at sraymonds's record you've been able to deduce that his "newbieness" is an act?adamrights wrote:
Really now? Because looking back at my record you've been able to deduce that this usage seems a bit forced? How so?8-)
Do I contradict myself?
Very well then I contradict myself,
(I am large, I contain multitudes.)
Could you make a scumlist? You suspect four people in this post, which is 4/9. 4/9 = 44.4%. You suspect close to half the people in this game! The reason I'd like a scumlist is to see who are your strongest suspects, and in which order.adamrights wrote:I think there is a scum between Kirb/Pablo and a scum between Pom/DB.
Later you vote for Kirby. Then you post this:
There you are contradicting yourself! Right after this you unvote. But you were going very strongly against Kirby, I don't see what made you suddenly change your mind.adamrights wrote:After reading over all of Kirbs post I'm not as convinced he's scum.
I think I know who I'm voting for.Vote: adamrights.-
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When I read your claim I was considering. Claimed cop. No counterclaim as of yet (it hasn't been long, but I doubt there will be one). At L-1. Has a breadcrumb. I think I'm ready to unvote. But then you'll say that I just don't want to look scummy. Ah, WIFOM. But I do think you're the cop. So I guess I willUnvote.
Also, who are you planning on investigating tonight, as of right now? (,I guess it depends on the lynch).-
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Exalt's a good choice, but if I am your top scum suspect (I don't know if I am) then wouldn't you investigate me? Isn't it best to find scum?adamrights wrote:i was thinking of investigating exalt, pablo or katy -- although i was leaning more toward exalt because i figured if pablo was town the scum might knock him off.-
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I didn't jump on a wagon for Exalt if that's what you're referring to. I said it was a possibility, which is true. You have to explore all the possibilities to see if you are missing anything. I agreed that Exalt could be scum, but he's not my top suspect.Kirby wrote:Also, Pom has jumped on wagons fairly quickly. At first I didn't think she was scum, now I'm not so sure...-
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If you are a cop then there is only a 50% chance that there is a roleblocker:adamrights wrote:If we don't get the RB, you can assume I'll be blocked anyway tonight...
-1 Mafia Goon, 1 Mafia Roleblocker, 1 Sane Cop, 1 Doctor, 5 Townies.
-2 Mafia Goons, 1 Sane Cop, 6 Townies.
So we shouldn't assume that. But it is likely that the mafia will kill you, considering your role.-
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You're all going to hate me for it, but my claim is townie. I'm a vanilla, and I have no extra information.
If you want to hear some thoughts from me...
I like Raskol. He's contributing way more than DB. Also, I have a gut feeling that Kirby is town. He's made some mistakes, but I think they're due to newbieness.-
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I explained to you all of my actions, yet you ignore my defense. Have you read my posts where I defend myself from each of your points? It seems as though you haven't. If you have explain to me why the defenses weren't valid.YDK wrote:[Pom] was quick to jump on several bandwagons.
I'm sure at least one of the scum is on my bandwagon, not wanting to cast suspicion on him/herself. If I am lynched, tomorrow pay close attention to those individuals that were strongly against me.-
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Pomegranate Mafia Scum
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Pomegranate Mafia Scum
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I noticed this too, and I thought it was odd. But if we know that there's a cop, there's a 50% chance that there's a doc too.Pablo wrote:ExaltExalt wrote: I don't think you will die because I believe we have a doc
Why? You know 1 thing: there is a cop. There should be no reason for you to think there is a doc unless you know there is a goon/RB, i.e. you are scum. Yay, more role talk to drive Pablo goddamn insane!
Scenarios:
-1 Mafia Goon, 1 Mafia Roleblocker, 1 Sane Cop, 1 Doctor, 5 Townies
-2 Mafia Goons, 1 Sane Cop, 6 Townies.
...but it's still weird. Why would he assume that it's the former setup rather than the rather? I don't find it voteworthy, but it's something to think about.Fos: Exalt.-
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Pomegranate Mafia Scum
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Pomegranate Mafia Scum
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My last post was accidentaly submitted before I said anything. Annoying.
I didn't post anything becuase I was in the middle of reading through the thread and I wanted to finish before posting. The only post I made before finishing reading through was post 450 which ended up wrong (MM had also claimed by that point) because I hasn't finished reading.Katy wrote:
But you didn't say anything? Why not?Pomegranate wrote: I noticed this too, and I thought it was odd-
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Pomegranate Mafia Scum
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This is just weird. Do we have a doc?...I wonder who adam investigated last night.Show"You're a silly Pom. Silly silly girl." -Fate
"I didn't want to use you Pom... I never killed you. I didn't endgame you it was my evil buddies!
Sowwy >_<" -scumFate.
"Pom was on my "I will not kill, and I shall seek vengeance upon the death of them" list." -CSL-
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Katy, I think there are two situations:
- There's a doc who protected the mafia target last night.
-The mafia roleblocked themselves in order to make it appear as though there is a doc, so that if one of them is close to lynch, he/she can claim doc. At this point the mafia know the setup, so they know whether or not there is a doc. This is how the mafia know the setup: Assuming adam is cop, there are two possible setups. Either there is also a doc and a roleblocker, or there is neither. The mafia knows whether or not they have a roleblocker, so they are able to figure out if there is a doc or not.-
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Pomegranate Mafia Scum
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