Newbie 744 -- Game Over!

[alexhans]

/confirm

[alexhans]

Good... So we are set.

[alexhans]

[quote=RAivann]vote: alexhans . You're not a plate of croissants[/quote]
I don't follow... Explain me the joke

To those who ask me to vote I say... I read page 1 and the title that said Pre-game and thought we couldn't start yet. I posted only to realize there was already a page 2 with votes. I'm gonna say also that random voting last is weird so I won't random vote at all but vote to the one that voted me second (perhaps trying a bandwaggon in my direction so that everyone would follow and he wouldn't look scummy for jumping afterwards?). Whatever.

Vote Boltrig.

[alexhans]

I have problems with both of them.
Alex said that he hadn't seen it yet that we had started voting, while in the post above his, I voted you. To me, that seems hard to miss. But I don't think it's important right now.

READ! I saw the title that said Pre-game, then fast-read the page 1 and posted a comment to state my happyness that this was about to start. I never realized there was a page 2. I just wrote the reply.

Whatever.

I'm gonna keep my RV on alexhans for saying Whatever as a sentence.

lol

Ill keep the vote where it is since alexhans should have realised if I wanted to bandwagon, syndromeofadown would have been a better candidate. (One vote down and two FoS)

err... probably true... maybe the two foses werent really serious? or you prefered another, more silent candidate?

nahh...

Unvote

[alexhans]

I'm not buying Alex's explanation yet. Even if he fast-read the first page, he should still have seen the last post of page 1, where the mod announces that the days has started.
And even then, I'd like to know why you did fast-read, Alex.

It's Ok. I know we are having a hard time getting out of the random vote stage, I'm ok with being pressured a bit.

Should I notice this?

And now with everyone here, we begin. Game on. With 9 alive, it will take 5 to lynch.

It's the last post (unbolded, uncolored) of a page that says pregame... And you were all joke voting and stuff before we had confirmed... So I guess not.

MOD:

perhaps you could use a personal color so we easyly notice you.

@ alexhans -

I'd also like to know why u did "fast-read"

I was at W O R K OK? (I should encrypt this, lest they find it and realize I don't work "ALL" the time)

Oh... And regarding my "-" connector of words...(I use it to emphasize that I would've said it fast linking it together) english is not my native language so I may make some mistakes or write a bit different from you.

lol hi?

did i really not post anything? if so, im sorrie. T-T lol
i thought i did, or maybe im too caught up in another game .. penguins and stuff -.-"

well here i am =D

What is this? NULL. Nothing.

o.o lol ummm....

i dont know actually

did we vote yet?

Oh come on!

oh lol i forgot i voted for him... haha >_<
oh yeah.
cause he voted for me

mmmm... If you keep up the cute I-don't-know-where-I'm-standing attitude I'll vote you. Give us some opinions about something.

[alexhans]

wellll...

SOD:

Unvote

I'm not going to put Miz.Mafia at L-2 just because she's a girl Rolling Eyes

yeah, i dont understand why you guys are very impatient, yes also very SEXIST?...

lets pretend im a guy now then, and stop being bitches just cause' im a girl. mmkay?
yeah, thanks for unvoting me cause' im a girl. but also rolling ur eyes at the end is just so.. sexist. shows me how much guys think girls arent capable of "games".

&& yeah, i never replied inawhile cause im out? dont u guys go out? shesssh =)

Get out of here... I JUST realized you're a girl for all your posting... I didn't even look at your avatar (that now i see says, I Love being a girl)

I fully respect your gender (and believe that everyone else does too) and really don't make any difference about it. So let's not introduce an innecesary subject.

sigh~ im done. lol.. i think mafia scumm is alittle to harsh for me. so im gonna get replaced =) it was a fun game guys. but i cant take it... it tears me up o.o

im quiting mafiascum T-T

bye guys~~ its been fun.

I would only want this if you really wont respect deadlines and get prodded all the time... If you can't post very often it doesn't matter... As long as you put your heart into the game and try to contribute in whatever way you think best...

This game is really fun although, it is true, it can get harsh at times seen it is a psycological game. But therein lies the emotion of trying to discover the hiding enemy and avoiding being mislynched. Or just creating chaos if you're mafia.

What happens in-game (emotions and all) stays in game. I like to think we would all be friends if we could hang out in the same physical place.

AshKetchummm replaces Mizz.Mafia.

Well... too late apparently. Doesn't matter.

@Ashketchummm: What do you think of the game so far? Any suspicions?

[alexhans]

Alex: Attacked and threatened to vote. Dropped the "too late apparently. Doesn't matter" after she was replaced. Asked a question to the replacement.

I don't like voting lurkers just for the sake of it because they're usually just not interested in the game or forgerful. I've seen my share of lurker lynches and they all turned to be townies. What I didn't like was the attitude... being all cute and not addressing what was going on in the game.

It doesn't matter what I said about respecting girls and all I said about mafia because she had already left. I started writing answering post after post.

[alexhans]

I don't like how ash is saying he "admits" that mizz looked scummy, yet says "but now that I took her role I know she's not". He obviously could very well be telling the truth about it, but something just seems fishy about that story that I can't quite put my finger on. Anyone else getting these vibes?

I agree that mizz's attitude was weird and now Ash's attempt to prove his innocence matter-of-factly is not looking townie at all.

Vote Ash.

[alexhans]

OK... Hi everybody... I just wanted to let you know that I had an accident practicing Taekwondo and nearly cracked my skull... I have to do a lot of resting now and Im not sure yet If I will undergo surgery or not (I'm out of risk irght now so probably not, Its not worth it just for aesthetics, I can take care of that in less risky but more patient ways).

I will catch up with the game this night or tomorrow and if by any chance, I need to absent myself, I'll let you know beforehand.

Sorry for the inconvinience.

This is the first time I touch a computer since Monday 2 (I spent nearly a week in a hospital.)

[alexhans]

first of all:

unvote

Mine was an intended pressure vote to get a reaction and the game going... and to see who would follow the bandwaggon... Unluckily i was absent to react quickly. Luckyly Ash was not quick lynched.

I just loved the way the crazy theory in #167 was presented...

Im thinking this game is a bandwaggon-frenzy... we should stop voting so much to l-1 or whatever and start some serious discussion. Remember you can pressure someone with a FoS too.

I'll analize closely blueshadow's posts (And some others too, of course) ... but I don't want a quick lynch just like that. We need content.

[alexhans]

i agree in general with all that's been said in #195. Blue looks like trying to be cool with the game (like a townie) and even pointing his style as scummy. Weird.

first of all:

unvote

Mine was an intended pressure vote to get a reaction and the game going... and to see who would follow the bandwaggon... Unluckily i was absent to react quickly. Luckyly Ash was not quick lynched.

Did you gain any information from this?

Er... not really cause I was the last too vote... and then some other bandwaggons started... And I couldnt keep pressuring him.

Alex, I hope you'll get better soon.
Anyway, what do you think of CntR's vote against Ash and Blue's response to this?

I don't know yet. I will read it closely again soon to see what I can make of it.

[alexhans]

blue hasnt appeared yet? Im definetly not voting him unless he appears... If he needs to be replaced, so be it.

[alexhans]

OK... So... being extremely positive ... we can rule out 2 and 3 setups. If there is a cop there is a mafia roleblocker. So the cop should know it. But DONT claim or you'll be blocked.

1 Mafia Goon, 1 Mafia Roleblocker, 1 Sane Cop, 1 Doctor, 5 Townies.

1 Mafia Goon, 1 Mafia Roleblocker, 7 Townies.
2 Mafia Goons, 1 Sane Cop, 6 Townies.

2 Mafia Goons, 1 Doctor, 6 Townies.

But I'm not going to rush my vote this time, and would like to hear from Cntr.

Glad you say this cause I felt like yelling at you when you hammered without letting blue answer.

I did a little readthrough today, and came up with this little gem.

In my opinion even scummier than blue, all because of Gimbo/Puta Puta. I've seen him both play as scum and as town. On this page he entered the game. Three pages later, he was lynched. Blue's play really reminds me of him.

That is interesting. Of course, just because another player behaves this way when town doesn't necessarily mean that is what Blue is doing. The primary difference I see is that Puta Puta kept emphasizing he was town (despite voting for himself! oO), whereas Blue hasn't really done that.
Still...food for thought. I am awaiting his comments when he responds to the prod.

It seems while being pressured, instead of making a case, you re directed the attention back to the other wagon forming. So I hope this is a good move, and it will get the game moving along because we won't have to find a replacement, and wait for them to catch up...while i still strongly dislike Cntr's play right now, I'm going to go ahead and.

Unvote- Vote: Blueshadow

YOU VOTED JUST TO MOVE THE GAME ALONG!!! ARGH!! BETTER KILL A MUTE SUSPICIOUS MAN THAN SEARCH FOR A REPLACEMENT? according to that we should've lynched your predecessor before you arrived...
You have just won a FoS!

FoS Ash

People... If you are suspicious of CnrT fine by me but try to make the day the a long one so we can discuss and get a lot of info for tomorrow. What we have until now seems crap but I'll re-read and see what I can found.

[alexhans]

OK... So... being extremely positive ... we can rule out 2 and 3 setups. If there is a cop there is a mafia roleblocker. So the cop should know it. But DONT claim or you'll be blocked.

1 Mafia Goon, 1 Mafia Roleblocker, 1 Sane Cop, 1 Doctor, 5 Townies.

1 Mafia Goon, 1 Mafia Roleblocker, 7 Townies.
2 Mafia Goons, 1 Sane Cop, 6 Townies.

2 Mafia Goons, 1 Doctor, 6 Townies.

But I'm not going to rush my vote this time, and would like to hear from Cntr.

Glad you say this cause I felt like yelling at you when you hammered without letting blue answer.

I did a little readthrough today, and came up with this little gem.

In my opinion even scummier than blue, all because of Gimbo/Puta Puta. I've seen him both play as scum and as town. On this page he entered the game. Three pages later, he was lynched. Blue's play really reminds me of him.

That is interesting. Of course, just because another player behaves this way when town doesn't necessarily mean that is what Blue is doing. The primary difference I see is that Puta Puta kept emphasizing he was town (despite voting for himself! oO), whereas Blue hasn't really done that.
Still...food for thought. I am awaiting his comments when he responds to the prod.

It seems while being pressured, instead of making a case, you re directed the attention back to the other wagon forming. So I hope this is a good move, and it will get the game moving along because we won't have to find a replacement, and wait for them to catch up...while i still strongly dislike Cntr's play right now, I'm going to go ahead and.

Unvote- Vote: Blueshadow

YOU VOTED JUST TO MOVE THE GAME ALONG!!! ARGH!! BETTER KILL A MUTE SUSPICIOUS MAN THAN SEARCH FOR A REPLACEMENT? according to that we should've lynched your predecessor before you arrived...
You have just won a FoS!

FoS Ash

People... If you are suspicious of CnrT fine by me but try to make the day the a long one so we can discuss and get a lot of info for tomorrow. What we have until now seems crap but I'll re-read and see what I can found.

[alexhans]

crap...

MOD: can you delete this post and the previous one because I accidentaly double posted?

[alexhans]

Well re-read done... Not surprisingly I didn't get much new ideas as to who is scum.

I got a bad feeling about a possible Ash and Cnt scum team but what didn't support my theory is that Ash almost hammered Cnrt and viceversa. So... I guess it's pretty ruled out... Is it too WIFOM to think something like that? That as both of them were taking a lot of heat they decided to attack each other?
first CnrT defended Mizz/Ash

...Humor is a scumtell now? ...that is interesting.

then he voted ash

I want to get this going somewhere, so... Vote ash

then he pretty much called for a hammer

Hmm...Blue is at Lynch-1 now...should we wait for him to post?

He said that from a different perspective he recognized mizz's actions as scummy. and then writes in Caps that he is a townie... Was this a claim? was this necessary? isn't this scummy?

I was just giving what my perspective was from a 3rd person point of view, before I took over her role, than pointed out that the more I read, the more I realized that she probably wasn't trying to look innocent while really being scum, and was just inexperienced.
I think the whole reason Mizz left was because SHE WAS A TOWNIE

Ash is fishy because he tried to hammer once and then actually hammered without giving a real explanation but just for the sake of moving on...

I think this is the hammer vote, and you are most likely going to condemn me for it, but I think it's in the best interest of the town to get rid of someone who acts scummy, and places votes without any real reason sooo....

But then he voted CnTr

I'm much more confident in a Cnt lynch then a blue lynch right now. So I'm keeping my vote on Cnt.

Yellowbunny attacked Ash.

Mind you, I am not saying that I don't find CntR at all scummy, because I do. But being willing to hammer over relatively weak arguments is very questionable.
Considering your predecessor's actions and now this...why should I not believe that YOU are scum Ash?

I didn't like all the Gimbo-puta puta argument brought buy Zazier. It isn't valid to compare other players and say how they acted to make players here scummy.

@yellowbunny.

Blue is clean. I'm 100% sure about this. Cntr is scummy, we've already been over this, no need to beat a dead horse. Ash at first seemed really scummy, and of course mizz mafia's play didnt really help his case much either, but the more he plays, the townier he seems. *shrug*

have you read that yellow was killed? or do you have supernatural powers to communicate with yellow... obviously blue is clean, he has flipped town.

alex, why just the FoS on Ash and no vote? And what makes you think all we have right now is crap?

because I haven't re-read and didn't want to change my vote in a flash... and I'm kinda afraid of your quick bandwaggons. you stated you prefered votes to FoSes... I don't.

@Zazier: Are you voting SoaD for not getting involved in the voting process? you think he did it to stay out of possible heat? let the town lynch themselves and stay clear?

[alexhans]

Raiv. At the bottom of the page, you see "All Users" with an arrow. Click the arrow and find the player you are looking for then click go.

Wow! this is great. I Hadn't realized this! the only downside is that it doesn't keep the number of subject of the whole gameplay so you have to go looking with another web page open with the whole game to get the real number in case you need to reference it.

[alexhans]

I got prodded.... I'm sorry... I was waiting and analizing and lost tract of the last time I had posted... I Had written some stuff but lost it when I moved back home yesterday... I have no connection right now (I have to get a new internet service) but Ill try to catch up anyway from a Cyber-Cafe.... Ill post tomorrow... I have no time today cause IT IS MY BIRTHDAY!

Don't dare Replace me...

[alexhans]

ups... Mixed smileys there...

[alexhans]

Catching up from a Cyber-cafe.
First of all... Happy birthday KMD!!!

Ok, thanks. I got my re-read done and I feel confident in a...

Vote:CntR

For all the reasons that have been previously stated by everyone
and I'm not believing his answers today

But I still think the fact that you said Mizz was a townie, and decided to vote for me anyways. I don't think thats just trying to get the game moving along, I don't think a Town player would risk lynching someone they thing it town no matter what

I agree

I'm more cautious during the beginning of the game, but less so later on.

not buying it

Yeah I know it's L1 , sorry alex but CntR is my top suspect by far and I feel my vote is in the right place

It's ok... But I dont like that you say in general all the reasons stated before by everyone... Better quote the reasons you think are valid.

Oh... I guess you did later. when KMD told you to in 254. I like that post better.

Hmm...Blue is at Lynch-1 now...should we wait for him to post?

Really wanting a quick blue lynch here , scummy post. To me this post sounds like- Someone please drop the hammer! Whether it's good for the town or not.

I agree. It's really fishy. Trying to appear cautious but calling for a hammer

mmm... big spot with CnrT responses... Don't know what to make of them.

alexhans is having a birthday today! Happy birthday! You share your birthday with my sister. Unless you just made up that birthday. If that's the case then disregard this =P

Thanks... and no... It IS my real Birthday. Great... tell your sister happy birthday from me... If she is 21 now then that's a big coincidence because we would be born the same day..

alexhans, well, I haven't seen very many insightful and townie posts from this guy, yet I haven't seen anything very outright scummy either. Neutral.

Ouch. guess I'll try to correct that. I'm re-reading and trying to find scum without help.

Thanks to raivann and Zazier too...

NOTE: I want to hear a response first from SoaD before someone may discuss this post. And I'd prefer it if Ash could respond afterwards, but this isn't obligatory.

Noted... Witholding in my notes a little commentary I had.

I'm leaning to a CntR lynch right now. Pending reasons in an organized post. I want him to be able to answer all questions(including mine) before I really decide on his lynch. (assuming nobody unvotes, then I would only vote him and not hammer him)
I think KMD is my biggest town-read right now.
Zaz and Ash are in my list of surveillance.
SoaD and Raivann are neutral.

[alexhans]

What's up with this? no opinions of my post? That CnrT and SoaD are not active doesn't mean we have to dissapear too.... Ash, Raiv, Zaz, Kmd? you there?

[alexhans]

PS: Expect a huge post from me tonight or tommorow morning. I'm off to disneyland with my family, ciao!

Great. Big post. Good trip. When are you coming back?

[alexhans]

Still waiting... I made that effort of catching up from a cibercafé for nothing?

Also posting to say HAPPY BIRTHDAY Zaz I hope you post soon! Have fun!

[alexhans]

Conspicuous_other... weren't you replaced recently in 761? What makes you think you have time now?
anyway Knox, Conspicuous hurry up!!! we need you to decide what's happening here.

[alexhans]

Zaz your attempt to defend CntR in 302 falls short.
While I agree that one meta isn't enough the other points lack strenght.

That vote of SoaD was during the RVS. His vote against Ash was serious

I want to get this going somewhere, so...

Vote:AshKetchummm

Yeah... Super serious and not scummy at all...

This is indeed true. But Ash hammered somebody without ever mentioning Blue, except for the time when he said that he saw CntR as scummier. So what's your opinion of that? And tell me why that's less scummy than what CntR has done.

Because Ash made only that mistake while CnrT made a whole lot more... Ash has a couple of things against him:
a) his inactivity
b) his hammer without explanations to get the game moving (almost the same scuminess as CnrT who left it at L-1 in the same manner)
c) his inactivity

While I don't like to leave him off the radar I don't feel he deserves a lynch right now. Anyway, I WANT him to post and state his opinions.

Cntr is scummy, we've already been over this, no need to beat a dead horse.

And as we're now talking about the CntR votes of last day, why weren't you one of them?

This IS interesting...

First of all, I never asked you to answer questions...

This is either lame or a joke I guess.

Also, he posted 'his case' at March 8 (my time). He didn't mention anything about his mother until the 29th, saying that his life had been stressfull that week. So how come he didn't mention his mother before that?

Diving into real life is a hard endeavour... We can't know for sure. An excuse isn't needed until they call you out for something...

Regarding What Conspic said I agree that Ash looks scummy. I just find his newbieness a possibility and I'm not willing to lynch him. And less when he is being replaced.

FoS: Conspic

for trying to take heat from him and push a player that cannot respond.

Zaz, KMD... I'm not willing to make metas part of a case on someone... Not to condemn, not to defend. You keep throwing to much games in the open to prove your cases and I simply don't have time or interest to look that way. There's a million different strategies in a million different games.

Both games show what's happening here as well. You attack a player, I disagree and give reasons why, and add my own suspicions. But in both games, you never stated that it would give me scumpoints. So why's that suddenly the case in this game?

This is strecth.

322: mmm Ash is not here and you suddenly start making a case against him... I find this highly suspicious. You know he is being replaced right? Why lay the case now and not when he is here? You have the wish that he is quicklynched now perhaps?

[alexhans]

CnrT's case IMO.
First he Fosed SoaD for a stupid punctuation thing and when called on why no vote he voted SoaD. Basically obsequiousness is scummy.

Thought that she was mostly a lurker-ish (who could be putting up a newbie pose) player before she left, but at the moment, I feel that she might just be a confused townie.

I want to get this going somewhere, so...

Vote:AshKetchummm

Great Reasons for leaving Ash for the hammer... No, Not really.

I wished to put more pressure on Ash, and get more information...and I'm a very erratic person, really.

This explanation is not enough for me.

On a side note. Soad's crazy theory paired up Zaz and CnrT. After that Zaz started attacking SoaD... But, then again the theory of bussing scum team on day 1 is a bit ridiculous because scum usually prefer to let things flow in wrong directions. Not give town chances to find scummy attitudes.

Hmm...Blue is at Lynch-1 now...should we wait for him to post?

This speaks for itself. I've already said it.

I find Day 1 very boring when it lasts long, so I wanted to end it as soon as possible, so we can get on to more interesting discussions based on more solid evidence, rather than the straw catching of Day 1.

This may be either inexpirience or scummyness. It's the same dilemma I have with Ash. And the reason why Conspic (CnrT's) replacement votes for him:

He apologized? A person goes for two seperate hammers (the first one being only two posts after another vote, might I add), kills a guy without giving him a chance to respond, and you let him get away with an apology?

Anyway, I gotta say that this point makes Ash looks far scummier than CntR but as he registered 27 nov 2008 and Ash 27 Feb 2009 I tend to think about Ash as much more newb.

Yes. I'm pretty arrogant in a way because I don't ussually consider myself as newb while playing. Later I discover that I made some stupid avoidable mistakes, but I'm learning fast.

Do I think CnrT/Conspic merits a vote right now? I'm guessing no. There's still a lot of things to discuss and I'm not convinced that he is probably scum. I need to strongly suspect I'm right to lynch someone.

This game is the first one in wich I have really feel absolutely lost. I have to admit to myself that I haven't looked much at some characters that I assumed town and forgot about them (KMD and Raivann) and I had some suspicions regarding Zaz. SoaD was neutral read. regarding Ash I thought him as newb townie. And CnrT looked scummy. So what I'm saying is that I haven't been flexible and made a really good analysis of the game so far. I have to free my mind...

Blue is clean. I'm 100% sure about this. Cntr is scummy, we've already been over this, no need to beat a dead horse. Ash at first seemed really scummy, and of course mizz mafia's play didnt really help his case much either, but the more he plays, the townier he seems. *shrug*

This was pointed out by Zaz in response to my question... I don't know what to make of it.

ZazieR, you are very critical(a good thing), and often your posts seem helpful. However, something about you seems fishy.

This is the feeling I have right now. Useless gut.

I think your SoaD case is just as strong as my CntR case, for his not voting Cntr yesterday and for him not trying to defend himself.

How can you say that your CntR case is as strong as the SoaD one when you only have two points to why SoaD was scummy? Especially when you did a large posts on reasons why CntR was scummy.

QFT. Really.

^^Says the player who had his only serious vote against Ash on day 1, and FoSed at the start of day 2. And his hammer was way scummier than CntR's action. Besides, if that action was scummy to you, how come you didn't say that during day 1?

Mine was an intended pressure vote to get a reaction and the game going... and to see who would follow the bandwaggon... Unluckily i was absent to react quickly. Luckyly Ash was not quick lynched.

As I've said in this post. I agree with Ash being scummier than CnrT regarding that action. I also stated why I felt it wasn't necessarily scummy (newbiness).

Does nobody get my point? He gave as excuse that he didn't mention Blue's actions due to his mother being sick. So why did he have time to write a 'crazy theory', which was probably a joke?

I will be reviewing this.

This is a big stretch. Yaw mentioned that Ash was prodded, but when C_o and I wrote our posts against Ash, it wasn't known yet that he was getting replaced in another game.

True. I realized that later.
------

FoS for calling out your defense? That's OMGUS and we aren't even in the RVS

I'll respond to the rest of your posts later on Kevin, but now that the game's over, I can talk about my FoS against you.
Open 121
I 'defended' Hewitt in this game and attacked somebody else.
In newbie 696, I also didn't support the Raider wagon, and I gave my reasons for that at the start of the game. At the same time, I was attacking Stef and Raz.
Both games show what's happening here as well. You attack a player, I disagree and give reasons why, and add my own suspicions. But in both games, you never stated that it would give me scumpoints. So why's that suddenly the case in this game?

And what you called a stretch in your post, isn't one at all. Why would he warn me that it would give me scum points if C_o turns up scum when he hasn't done that before?

Where in hell does it say that if C_o turns scum it'll give you scumpoints? He called out on you because you Fosed him for Attacking CnrT (and laying a pretty decent case) and not accepting your defense. And you suddenly say that it doesn't give you scumpoints if C_o Flips scum because of this game and that game, etc, etc. Basically. You jumped for nothing

However, Alex was waiting till players would comment on his catch-up post, while there wasn't much to respond to. He also said that he'd write a post in which he'd give his points against CntR.

Subtle attacks annoy me. It's true that there is only one request there (to Raivann, quote the case against CnrT, wich he didn't do). Raiv voted Cnrt in this post but didn't lay a case himself. I find that strange.


If you're wondering why the long post... I finally have working Internet at home!

[alexhans]

what do you mean with "You guys lynched syndromeofadown for 95, right?"?

Don't you think that it would be wiser to vote after you have read everything so you can post a decent case and ask some decent questions instead of that fast sentences?

[alexhans]

I haven't made myself time to read charter's posts and investigate what he is talking about... But please charter... If you can... Link the numbers or quote the phrases or at least state what the F%&/ are you talking about....

right now I only see:
post x is weird.
y I agree
z Oh It's incredible John doe did this...
a This is lame....

See my point? if you make no questions and only comment without explaining is practically useless.

I still gotta look at some things like:

Incorrect. It made me wonder if he actually believed 'his case'. I started attacking him after he posted his opinion of Blue.

@Zaz: I think about ash as a newb townie pretty much since he replaced and I saw his join date and his playstyle. All that about not reading his role when replacing and saying Mizz was scummy was silly for an experienced player to do IMHO. Anyway, as I didn't want to be fooled by a scum newb I decided to put a quick vote on Ash and see if someone tried to defend him or if he reacted oddly but then I had my accident and everything changed.

If you think that I'm attacking you with this, you're wrong. It was used for a question to knox.

Yeah, but along the lines of you saying that there was nothing to answer in my post you make me look like I'm stalling the game.

I had my accident on march 2. A week later I went to my mother house (with internet) till my birthday when I moved back to my house (My father's) and had no internet till this weekend. (20 days aprox).
Now don't accuse me just because I put my mother in the game

Also Alex, you said that you had notes regarding my case against SoaD. Have you posted these already or not?

I think you mean this

NOTE: I want to hear a response first from SoaD before someone may discuss this post. And I'd prefer it if Ash could respond afterwards, but this isn't obligatory.

Noted... Witholding in my notes a little commentary I had.

I really don't remember what it was... I recall writing some little comments and posting them in my notes (On my user notes) but then I deleted them along accidently along with some huge notes for an ongoing game on a boat.
I posted what I found weird about SoaD. I didn't see much things that tinged my scumdar... I still have to review what you say about his mother and all that. I need a re-read.

[alexhans]

I fosed Ash for dropping the hammer without explaining. I still see that as a possible newb mistake because he seemed to regret it but it made me wary anyhow. Also, That was way after (Day 2 start) my pressure vote on him and my accident (Day 1).

[alexhans]

Anyway, I gotta say that this point makes Ash looks far scummier than CntR but as he registered 27 nov 2008 and Ash 27 Feb 2009 I tend to think about Ash as much more newb.

Not true. Look at their metas, Ash was in 2 other games while this one was going on, whereas CnT has played in one other game besides this one, so the difference in experience is negligible, if not nonexistent or actually in Ash's favor.

It might be wrong but that was my impression... I didn't meta them.

[alexhans]

I agree with KMD... Post 60 is null tell.

[alexhans]

It's entirely possible both you and ZazieR are scum and I'm rightly suspicious of you.

How many times have you seen a game where both ICs are scum. It just doesn't happen.

Woah. Wait a minute. WRONG. This is a false assumption that I don't like you making. You're supposed to help newb regardless of your alignment and this is a lie. You can perfectly be both scum Example. It may be improbable but, as charter said, it's possible.

[alexhans]

charter wrote:

Ok, just to make my point clear. I can not fathom Conspicuous Other being scum. If he was, there would be him and his buddy trying to get someone else lynched. This is not the case. This wagon has mislynch written all over it. ALL OVER IT!

conspicous_other wrote:

Whatnow? Tunnel Vision much?

Anyway, that's all from me tonight. For now, FOS: Kmd4390, I'll take a look at some more stuff tomorrow, but if nothing pops out at me I'll bump that up to a vote.

You mean like this?

I thought this might come up. If I'm scumbuddies with charter, that means I was scumbuddies with ash, and if I was scumbuddies with ash, post 319 doesn't make much sense, now does it?

Not really. You could still do that as scum. To distance yourself from him.

I've been meaning to re-read this game but haven't managed to make time yet. I know the deadline is near. CnrT's lynch wouldn't be the worst IMO.

I would like everyone to try and compress they're cases on their votees or suspects in to very short posts directly to what you think are the facts. I think there has been a lot of arguing but not much to take from it. Charter, Conspic and Knox have brought new suspicions but backed them up insufficiently IMHO.
I am wary of Zaz. I have no reads whatsoever on KMD and Raiv. That's what makes them scary too. I have a slight town read on SoaD/Knox. And CnrT/Conspi and Charter/Ash have done their scummy things.

So, basically, I don't know what to do.

For now. Im gonna follow my gut.

Vote KMD

[alexhans]

WARNING: LONG POST

(Read it only when you're clear headed. Important as hell.)
Well... It seems I failed again. I began to fear KMD after all that has happened and some things the replacements brought up. So I tried to trigger a response by the players to see how you reacted to my vote. Only 3 people posted and only one called my attention to it. I also can't stall my wait for reactions any longer because deadline is near. So...
First of All:

unvote

Charter didnt address my gut vote (but as it is his own vote it's not that strange) when he posted 22 minutes later.
Zaz noted the huge change and noted it, asked me to explain.
Knox didnt address my vote.

I've done a full re-read. Trying to be as much objective as possible. it took me like 3 hs to do this. I owed it to this game.
You may have noticed that I changed my view a lot. I'm not wary of Zaz now (at least not more than any other player in the game). This re-read has made me see that some of my last posts were very poor because I lacked info on what was going on. I was lost. 324 was an attempt to pressure you and see how would you respond.

Some thoughts about the last posts first:

Yes, it would make sense for two scumpartners to do so. It's called bussing.

yeah right! bussing each other to L-1.... Pretty good...

I'd also like to hear what happened to this:

I'm leaning to a CntR lynch right now. Pending reasons in an organized post. I want him to be able to answer all questions(including mine) before I really decide on his lynch. (assuming nobody unvotes, then I would only vote him and not hammer him)

331 is my case on CnrT. Zaz has asked for it many times, even after it. There it is. Haven't you seen it?


NOW my reads on every player (this was not looked at ISO but in the whole game, I just separated every player):
-----------------
Raivann (replacing MotandsArm)

I think her reaction- quitting - is scummy. So yeah i'm still happy with my

vote.

CntR are you scumbuddies with Ash?

This is the kind of anti-town statements I dislike.
When Ash is at L-1, unvotes, votes CnrT, When CnrT is at L-1, unvotes. (that looks

town to me, as scum he could just dissapear for a while)
votes blueshadow.

@ Zazie- Can you tell me how to look at just one player's posts in isolation?

Why Zaz and not both IC's?

@ the IC's - How do I look at 1 player's posts in isolation?

Finally, he did ask both. Zaz hadn't answered him...

Syndrome's last post does look fishy to me though. Looks like he's

bussing/distancing himself from CntR and it reads like it was planned.

After Zaz suspects Soad Raiv says he is fishy. THIS IS SCUMMY. throwing something

out to suspect with the flow.

Ok, thanks. I got my re-read done and I feel confident in a...

Vote:CntR

For all the reasons that have been previously stated by everyone
and I'm not believing his answers today

He puts CnrT at L-1 with little reasoning without making a case for himself. Scummy.
http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... 570817]254: he

states a better case.
302Zaz

dismisses ALL of KMD's points against CnrT

I think Ash case is not as strong, because I think he just dropped the hammer

too quick.

So he is not more suspicious of Ash because of that? He already suspected him...
385 Is a measured and low key response not answering points but in general.
--------------

knox (replacing syndromeofadown)
79: Didn't feel confortable when Mizz mafia was at L-2 (oh.... but it his RVS so null

tell)
http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... 563205]230 by

SoaD. As if it was in the previous day. Responding to a dead yellowbunny and voting

for CnrT because he "is scummy and we've been over this".

what do you think of yellow's death. Why do you think mafia decided to kill

him/her?

Also, what do you think about me ignoring yellow's questions until after he/she was

dead? Coincidence?

It seems ‘convenient’ that you decide to post you opinion on Zazie’s post now that I have voiced my suspicions, even though it had been days since the post and you posted in between without a comment to it.

This seems to be a trend with Raiv.
--------------

charter (replacing AshKetchummm, who replaced Mizz.Mafia)
Mizz never adressed a point. She kept throwing around the sexist thing till she

quit.
Ash replaces and says that mizz was kinda scummy but then he saw she was really

inexperienced.
105: points at SoaD for making a joke... mmm...
In retrospect, not reading your role and posting who you think is scummy is weird.

Raivann, seems like you were pushing pretty hard for her in the beginning and

are still going for it strong through me

Trying to get an innocent out quick in the beginning?

This is were Ash starts going on for Raivann.
137: Is a

stretch rushed case on Raiv. OMGUS?
170: Ash tries to

hammer CnrT!!! without much case.

Well even though it wasn't the hammer, I feel my vote is still

in the right spot, and Cnt hasn't given a valid reason as to why I shouldn't vote for

him.

Not liking this.

Well I gave valid reasons to support my vote, and I really think that he

is scum, and also he has made no attempt to prove that he is innocent, all he did was

say that he an erratic player, and then went on to point the direction at someone

else, simply because they answered a question with a question.

This is a good point by Ash.

I'm much more confident in a Cnt lynch then a blue lynch right now. So

I'm keeping my vote on Cnt.

Then why he hammered Blue?
hammer by

ash Didn't like this at all... As I've said.
Charter replaces and votes Zaz without saying why.

FOS syndromeofadown for 87.

Ok... he foses but doesn't say why. 87. Why do you FOS this? What's scumym about it?

You guys lynched syndromeofadown for 95, right?

What's this... State your f%&/%$& reasons when you say something.
I don't like charter's posts where he doesn't explain anything but appear to be helping.

Ok, one of blueshadow and Raivann is scum. Figuring out which one will be the tough part.

Seeing blue is dead... Raivann is scum to you? eh?

181- kmd, what? I've never seen you pull something like that as town before.

What? WHAT?!

254- This looks important, but it's late and I didn't read it. Will come back to it later and see what I think.

264- Same deal.

I really skimmed the last two or so pages.

Really helpful

Yes, but CntRational had posted early in the game, it gave me town vibes.

post 60, a lurker lynch is a great scum tool if people in the town accept it

Actually, now that I look back over his posts, I'm unsure why I thought his early posting gave me town vibes. That was really the only one in the first several pages.

You left CntRational when he was at L-1 because "discussion is good"

He has a point against KMD here. KMD should've been more cautious. His vote seemed opportunistic all right.

54- If Dennis1993 is ever revealed scum, syndromeofadown is his partner.

first blue or shadow. Now dennis and Soad.... How do you throw those unsupported accusations like that?
LOOK AT THE FUCKING POST 52 for god's sake.

141- Holy crap. Raivann just sweeps his loaded question under the rug. Very scummy.

I dont get it. Look at the said post:

lazy scumhunting.

This charter post is so tiring. having to go to the source each time to try to understand what he is talking about!! It's misleading. I don't know who else followed every post. I did know and find so many inconsistencies that it sucks. It looks scummy.
Then votes KMD saying Probable scum team is KMD RAiv.
--------------


Conspicuous_other (replacing CntRational)
CnrT's care of voting someone who has a vote was weird.
151: Here

is the condemning move of CnrT. Vote to get things going that early. Leaving him at

L-1.
Votes blue after he is getting heat. Forgets about Ash?
204:"Hmm...

Blue is at Lynch-1 now...should we wait for him to post? ". Another Super scummy

post by CnrT.

2. I find Day 1 very boring when it lasts long, so I wanted to end it as soon

as possible, so we can get on to more interesting discussions based on more solid

evidence, rather than the straw catching of Day 1.

This is totally inconsisten with his not voting for fear of putting someone

at L-2.
His defense in 242 is not satisfactory.
Conspic replaces and votes Ash. mainly for the two hammers (one almost)

I thought this might come up. If I'm scumbuddies with charter, that means I was scumbuddies with ash, and if I was scumbuddies with ash, post 319 doesn't make much sense, now does it?

Makes sense. A lot of sense.
--------------


ZazieR*
She kept pushing on an on with my not voting in my first post.
Zaz didn't like Mizz quiting post.
Votes for CnrT because of the L-1 on Ash.

You're wrong Yellowbunny. They are definitly scummy. In my opinion even

scummier than blue

If they were scummier than Blue why you were voting blue?

Also, I'm not gonna state my opinion why I think that Yellowbunny was the NK.

In my opinion, it will only lead to WIFOM.

I don't think speculating night choices is that bad. But seeing yellow was new we

have less info.
I've read it. But I don't really see your point about SoaD's mother.
--------------


Kmd4390*

I thought it was weird that I hadn't jokevoted you before, so I looked

at our past games.

Cnt was the one I had a problem with. At least until I looked up his

meta. The FoS without voting always looks suspicious to me. In the RVS, it's even

worse. But seeing that he played a cautious game as town in his other game, I think

that's a null tell as well. Maybe even a slight town tell.

Didn't you later used this to make a case against CnrT?

Zazie: Answered a question Mizz asked pre-game. Normal IC procedure there.

Asked Mizz a question to help get things started. Said more about Mizz AFTER she was

replaced than while she was actually playing.

This may not be important but notice how KMD always seems to be justifying Zaz's

actions.
Votes, after Zaz, for CnrT because of the L-1 on Ash.
Asks Blue why he voted Raiv. (when blue hadn't explained)

Hum...Well, since we cannot continue ahead

without blue, we can discuss a few things while he's gone...

Why not?

This is excessive. It looks like being sure you're always asking questions. Being

on the detective side.

1) The FoS in the RVS when you weren't voting anyone. I saw this as cautious

play matching your meta, but that's wrong as you have been more aggressive lately.

2) The fear of putting SoaD at L-2 which is notable because of your L-1 vote on Ash

later.

3) Calling out Dennis for lurking when a few others were worse offenders,

specifically Mizz.

4) Also quick to jump on the "lurker" who had posted 30 hours before you called him

out.

5) Called Mizz a confused townie and then voted Ash 3 posts later with little

reasoning.

6) Placed Ash at L-1 with little reasoning. Looks like you want to lynch pretty

quickly there.

1) you cleared him before but condemn him now? Convenient change of mind.
2) This is a good point. Very Good.
3) This is a null tell IMO. I forget about things too.
4) Same as before. I jumped in my second game to lurkers for less than 24 hours of

posting.
5) linked with 6
6) This is weird. but it's mainly point 2.
It looks like out of 1 good Point you made actually spread into 6! To make your case

seem better?

KMD quickly votes for CnrT for the same reasons as yesterday. No talking about the

kills? Weird.

Hmm. I actually don't see the case on SoaD.

But doesn't say why...

Raiv, can you give some reasons of your own why CnT is scummy? Or even just

tell us what specific points against him you agree with and what answers you don't

believe?

So CnTscum=SoaD +scum points, Ash +town points. Remember this if CnT flips

scum.

I agree with the later. I don't know why the former should be like

that.

Also, I hope you realize if CnT flips scum, you get scum points for defending him like this.

I have missed this previously. It is suspicious.

3. Yes, witholding info is scummy.

Unless, as you said, it touches rolefishing...
-----------

Isolated thoughts:
Zaz and KMD asked CnrT and me why no vote.
Too much back and forth joking commenting between Zaz and KMD.
I don't see Ash and Raiv being on a scumteam.
I don't see Ash and CnrT being on a scumteam.
I've been doing some research and Mizz actually quit Antarctic Mafia, and Idyllic

mafia for the same reasons as this game. Although she talked a whole lot more in

Antartic.
@KMD: What is your read on Raiv?

I don't like Mizz/Ash/Charter in general and think his lynch might provide us good information. CnrT I think did some scummy things but I'm not willing to lynch him because I think he is town.
Raiv and KMD I'm wary of. But KMD seems to give more to the game. So maybe Raiv's lynch is a good one.

[alexhans]

I will... I just need to think about it and get answers to my post.

As I've said I would go with either Charter, Raiv or KMD.

[alexhans]

Well... I screwed the post... I forgot to disable the line formatting and it separates the lines now. But I don't have the last version saved to repost. Read it carefully. Also, I mixed up some parts. There's a thing about Zaz in Raivanns part. Screwed a lot of [url quotes... But you can copy paste them or look at the number. I'm sorry if isn't the easiest read. But make an effort if you're town.

[alexhans]

Normally when someone says "I did XXXX to get reactions" that comes after they get called out for something, and they are scum, and they are trying to put some legit reasoning behind their action. It doesn't really matter the reason for their original action, it happens because the scum perceives what someone else says as an attack and try and quickly defend against it.

That was SoaD's RVS vote.

..that's how I make posts whenever I replace into a game. Short and sweet. I am not a fan of long posts, so I try and avoid making them. I know I don't explain my thoughts very well, but I do the same thing whenever I replace in to a game (which is often, so I don't have time to make gigantic posts).

yes, But as I've said in post 345 you don't explain your comments nor link the numbers so It's awfully hard to follow you. It could be seen as trying to make it harder so we just take your word for it.

This is just a really scummy statement. Scum try and 'win', town lynches scum.

I disagree... I want to win. I want to find scum to win. Finding scum is not my ultimate goal. My goal is finding scum and saying: IN YOUR FACE! I feel you're stretching too hard here.

He's defending Dennis, why on earth would he do that if he isn't scum?

Why wouldn't he. He didn't necesarilly defend Dennis. He just noted that he wasn't the only one. I call that investigating.

MOD

(or whoever): Deadline is how many hours from now exactly? I'm at GMT -3 and it's 2:40 AM. ET is GMT - 4 so it would be 23:00 today in GMT -3 right?

[alexhans]

You have better points against CntR and Ash than anyone else. But for some reason CntR gets a free pass after you acknowledge his scummy posts, I don't understand that one.

I just feel that it's more probable that his lynch was scum driven and I liked Conspic responses. Charter/Raiv/KMD lynch can provide us with more info.

I don't recall YOU making a case against SoaD... Jumping on Zaz's waggon now?

Man... You only had 2 votes.... Why on earth would you claim early? And vanilla? Seriously man... That makes you only more suspicious.

180 is a post by yellowbunny by the way...

[alexhans]

WOW...

vote ZazieR

. Guess I was right with my first gut call.

[alexhans]

Also... KMD... you werent at L-1, I had unvoted in that huge post... I don't know if your read it. you were at L-2 with Charter's and Conspic's votes.

[alexhans]

we are 7... mislynch takes us to lylo... we can either trust him and lynch Zaz... and get a townie... then we go for KMD... otherwise we go for KMD we might get scum, but if we don't we kill the cop... But the cop is probably gonna die anyway...

It's 50-50 really here. But seeing I was suspicious of Zaz before and it was really a gut call... I'm gonna stick with it.

wait... someone wants to Counter Claim? that should be enough proof that KMD is lying at the risk of outing yourselves and being killed tomorrow... But we will have lynched scum...

[alexhans]

mmm... strike what I said... Im confused.

unvote

... I'll read Zaz and KMD yet again.

[alexhans]

Oh... it seems KMD never pushed a case against the person he had guilty on... ODD....

Cop. Dont counter claim. My bad.

[alexhans]

What I don't get is why he said that he was looking for your scumbuddy by voting CnrT... It would be easier to push for YOUR lynch and look at others reactions.

[alexhans]

I want to hear from C_O, knox and Raiv before voting for KMD...

[alexhans]

He was voting for CnrT, pushing CnrT's case from the beginning of the day. Ã

[alexhans]

Is the deadline in roughly 40 mins?

12 hours and 25 minutes now.

alexhans needs some scrutiny after kmd flips scum.

asks me the questions now... You could well be bussing KMD for that matter.

@KMD: mmm... I understand your thoughts... But I didn't understand what your supposed crumb is...

[alexhans]

dude... that's not a crumb... you could've just made it up when you claimed...

A crumb can be seen by someone if you don't say it. But is very subtle so It'll probably go unnoticed.

And you weren't positive about CnrT. You were positive about Zaz... I don't see a breadcrumb there at all. It looks kinda fake if I have to tell you the truth.

[alexhans]

like when you (KMD) said that both IC's weren't scum.

[alexhans]

I don't know why you rushed so much to lynch him... Raiv still hasn't posted.

[alexhans]

mmmm... that leaves

Raiv
Knox
C_O
Alexhans
Zaz (asked to be replaced)

Ok... I wanna first hear from Raiv what does he think about yesterday's events.

Why would Zaz replace? She doesn't seem to be replacing in other games?

Charter started voting Zaz but after reading fully he prefered KMD or Raiv.
He votes Raiv when there's a day left.
He says when KMD flips scum I'm gonna need some scrutiny.
He votes KMD.

I think C_O is pretty cleared in my eyes. KMD wouldn't push that hard on his partner. Knox doesn't seem scummy either. So I guess it's all between Zaz and Raiv IMO.

[alexhans]

KMD Iso.

If CnT is scum, SoaD is probably his buddy and Ash is probably town.

He knew CnT woudn't flip town... (unless Cnt was his mate, wich I don't think so) so he was kinda going to leave SoaD of the hook? Does that make SoaD/knox suspicious?
- He Denied that both IC's were scum

How many times have you seen a game where both ICs are scum. It just doesn't happen.

- Bussing CnrT day 2 seems a bit weird but now I think we should consider it a possibility.
-bussing Zaz would also be a weird play. But if they know there are no cops they may try it...

I'm a cop. I have a guilty on Zaz, but wanted to find her partner before lynching her. The way she defended CO makes me think it's him.

So... if Zaz flipped town he couldn't go after C_O... if she was his scumbuddy it would give him a lot of credibility and he could push C_O's lynch... But if she was scum she should've acted scummy so as to get lynched...

I don't like Zaz for being replaced but I'm starting to think knox is much more a possibility than Zaz.

Hmm. I actually don't see the case on SoaD.`

I think that if CO is town, Raiv is scum by process of elimination.

mmm...what does this mean??? that he knows C_O will flip town so he will crush Raiv next? That would make Raiv town... Or maybe he thought he was going to be lynched and tried to clear Raiv??? (Yeah, I know, It's kinda WIFOM but I wanna know what you think)

I wouldn't.

And Knox was the hammer.

Zaz, Alex, Charter, Knox.

Use my info. Lynch Zaz tomorrow. I'd look at CO next, but don't forget about Raiv either.

One of his last posts.... Setting up WIFOM to confuse us? He knew he was being lynched...

[alexhans]

EBWOP: @RAiv... Care to comment on yesterday's events? Who do you think may be scum? Why were you absent? Didn't you know it was deadline day?

[alexhans]

I'm planning on giving my opinions about the last posts in a detailed way. But I'm busy right now. Maybe in 6 hs or so. Nobody hammer anyone while I'm gone.

[alexhans]

@Porkens:

I'll do a brief

re-read

tomorrow and get some initial thoughts posted.

Does this mean you were following the game?
-----------------

Raivann (replacing MotandsArm)

Raivann backs down fast from his possition on Mizz after questioned by KMD.

ok.

blueshadow with a crap vote on raivann, kmd doesnt jump on him.

But he did say this:

blueshadow should explain his vote too, but I don't suspect him for the unexplained vote as it doesn't place Raiv at L-1 like CnT's vote on Ash.

Raivann never talks directly to KMD

This is something I noted too. Although he asked him maybe 1 or 2 questions he stood as far away as possible.

Raivann is happy voting for Mizz's replacement, riding the easily justifiable lynch.

mmm... But he unvotes and goes for CnrT instead for putting ash at L-1...

Raivann qualifies a lot in 138

qualifies what exactly? 138... I don't see anything particularly scummy here.

Raivann is trying to look town.

What's the point of this statement? Don't we all wanna look town? What town would like to look scum?

alexhans

KMD sucks Alex's penis a bit in 62.

On Alex, I buy his explanation for the no-vote. I'm not calling him town yet, but I'm not going to call him scummy for an honest mistake.

so? Didn't it look like an honest mistake? Did you read my explanation?

Alexhans white knights careful voting.

...??? white knights???

knox (replacing syndromeofadown)

SoaD is overcautios about putting Mizz at l-2

we were just starting the game... what's your point?

Conspicuous_other (replacing CntRational)

KMD half-way attacks CnT.

What do you mean half-way? what gives you that impression?

Cnt asks for suspicions on himself. KMD distances.

Cntr could be scum, contradicting himself from "I'm ascared of L-2" to "lets get this going" and putting ash at L-1

What do you think regarding the fact that KMD pushed his case first thing in the 2nd day?

Day 2

Raivann (replacing MotandsArm)

Raivann calls KMD pro-town

I did too. the important thing might be when did that happen.

Raivaan votes with KMD on CntR

Ok. But:

I think CntR is scummiest by far out of all players left and he would have gotten my vote yesterday if blue wasn't asking for it with his antitown scummy posts. Ash may have hammered a little quick but I can understand.

More hugging with KMD by Raivann

He hugged you too for that matter.

Raivann (finally) OMGUS's knox.

THIS, is really fishy.

alexhans

Alex humps KMD again.

Vulgar Slang To engage in sexual intercourse with.

...
err... no I didn't... What do you EXACTLY mean and where do you think happened.

alex slurps on KmD's ... "90 null"

Again, hard to see what you're talking about.

alex votes for KMD.

This was a try-to-get-a-reaction-vote as I've explained... It wasn't consistent with the post where I was voting him. Anyway, it turned out that upon re-read of the whole game I did find him scummy along with Raiv and Charter.

Alex jumps on the hammerer, but doesn't vote.

yeah. I wasn't really convinced of KMD being scum until I realized that scum knew they were no cops. And by that time Knox and Charter had already lynched him. And even if I was I would've liked to hear from Raiv.

knox (replacing syndromeofadown)

KMD weakly defends SoaD

Indeed. He said he didn't see the case but didn't state why.

SoaD buddies up to KMD

? If we know KMD is scum... why would you say SoaD was buddying him?

Knox attacks Raivann post 311, doesn't mention KMD at all.

mmm... so?

Knox ignores the case on KMD and goes after Raivann instead (still, again)

So? (still, again)

Conspicuous_other (replacing CntRational)

Conspicuous_other lurk lurk lurk non-contribute

I agree that his activity has been somewhat low. He has posted only 7 times but he usually made points in his posts. It wasn't non-contribution as you say.

CO votes KMD

With reasoning.
------------
--------------

Conclusion
Raivann is a great lynch today. He's been conspicous in his lack of confrontation with KMD. I'm slightly worried, though, because Knox has been so strongly going after Raivann that it borders on tunnel-vision, which is a scumtell in many instances. However, we do have a misslynch (we wont loose if we pick wrong today) so I'm fine with my initial reaction to the read which is;

vote: Raivann

Tomorrow, I'd hang Knox for his tunnel vision, or, just as happily, C-O for his predecessor's hypocrisy and his own lurking.

I suspect mainly Raiv.
Then I don't know wether you or Knox are scummier because you could've been bussed and it could totally work.
And finally Conspic is my less likely lynch because I found hard to believe that KMD would buss him so much.

Oh, and...

Where is everyone else?

[alexhans]

WHERE THE

BLEEEP

IS EVERYBODY????

I'm voting Raiv if he doesn't come up and say anything soon.

[alexhans]

Raivann was consistent in getting on the wagons (even preemptively) that were obviously going to draw a lot of attention. Sticking to his Mizz vote and getting on the CtN wagon were basically the same type of move; voting for the person who the town would obviously go after next. That's mostly my gut talking, but that's how it came off to me.

This is a tough call. I tend to agree with you because of his general gameplay. Cautious all game long can be a scum sign.

"Qualifying" language includes things like "perhaps," "maybe," and "seems." In the post I indicated, Raivann even points out his own qualifying language as a defense, noting that they should put him above suspicion. This is exactly why qualifying language is a scumtell.

um... I qualify language as town... When they misrep my semantics I usually qualify...

If I've offended anyone with my "vulger" language, I do apologize. It isn't meant to be literal, at all, and of course it wasn't intended to put anyone off their pudding. "makes out with," "humps," "hugs," "slurps the junk of," "crawls into the nutsack of," and "lovingly and tenderly embraces" are all synonymous with "buddies up to."

Oh, Ok. I wasn't offended. It's just that english is not my native language and I had to look up some of those words to see if they implied something else other than being too friendly or something.

In your case, I believe there was a post in which you wrote something to the effect of "KMD is really pro-town," or "KMD makes a really good point." This, now that we know KMD is scum, is a point to take note of. Of course it isn't a big scumtell, but it's a little/minor one. If you'd like me to find the exact post that made me take pause, let me know and I'll take a look for it.

It's logical that you suspect me for agreeing with KMD or thinking him town. Unfortunately, I really did. This is definetly not my best game. But at least with the coming of the replacements and my re-read I was able to open my mind a bit. But the fake claim completely befuddled me. I'm used to claims being true (or fake claimed by VI), this came as quite a shock (and a good learning experience).

"White-Knighting" is a term used for a player who defends or supports something strongly, like a chivalrous Knight will defend a damsel in distress from an evil dragon. Frequently, the object of the "White Knighting" is an obviously good idea, such as in your case when you defended "careful voting."

Noted. I'm a cool knight.

Mod: Prod Raiv & Conspic please

Knox still has a day.

[alexhans]

Yeah... I noticed it too.

What have players been doing?

Conspic

last posted in this game: Tue Apr 28, 2009 8:36 am
while he posted in MS: Fri May 01, 2009 9:00 pm

Raiv

: Last posted here and probably died a horrible death...

Knox

: last posted in this game: Sun May 03, 2009 9:21 am
while he posted in MS: Wed May 06, 2009 1:51 pm (and posted 4,5,6 too)

Zaz

: I still don't know why she replaced.

In addition, ZazieR has requested replacement as of this morning. She sends along the message that she enjoyed it a lot and wants to wish everyone a great game as long as it lasts. I'll try to get a replacement for her as soon as I can.

She is playing everywhere else in this site and I don't think she was replaced elsewhere... an IC being replaced is wrong. And it really makes me suspicious of her to quit for no reason.

KMD Bussed her? KMD lied about the possibility of 2 IC's being scum? Maybe.

@Knox: I need you too say state who would you vote today and tomorrow if you had too choose (Nevermind the night kill)

In fact
@everyone: Choose 1 lynch for today and 1 for tomorrow (Suppose there is no NK).

[alexhans]

Um is it odd that I find this slightly suspicious? I look at it and think that answering this would give the mafia, if they still live, a good idea of who to NK as they will probably keep the players under more suspicion in the game and possibly other strategies considering the results

No. At this moment I feel we need to lay our cards on the table. It's like a massclaim.
I'm afraid that if Raiv isn't scum everybody is going to squirm around their suspicions tomorrow. Suddenly they won't suspect the dead person but conveniently suspect a lot the alive people. That's why I'd like to introduce us into this "dangerous road" of WIFOM, you might say.
I prefer people discussing and stating their evidence now than waiting for an hipothetical tomorrow where they might be dead. Especially when Conspic seemed to be absent. Anyway, now that he is being replaced I think we can wait a bit longer.

@wake4me4life: Welcome! Take your time to read and tell us who do you think is scum.

Conspic... replacing in and out sucks a lot.
Remember when I asked this

Conspicuous_other... weren't you replaced recently in 761? What makes you think you have time now?

[alexhans]

FoS wake

You didn't even give your opinions on the game Son of a %"%$ (this is in-game anger)

Why hammer before Raiv could post?

[alexhans]

lol. GG wake!

I just was being cautious.

I wanted to be covered in case he didn't flip scum.

KUDOS to charter for this win.

Yaw: Thanks for modding this non-newbie-newbie game.

Did scum used a QT? Can we read it?

[alexhans]

ohhhh
I love QT's...

Anyway
I sucked at this game, Hard.

I had town reads on both scum throughout half the game.

My accident got me completely out of this game and then I had a bad feeling about Zaz and KMD but mostly Zaz.

The replacements saved my life! That proves my theory that replacements are always a huge benefit for town (unless they're scum)

I think I did one good thing

Post 401
aimed at both KMD and Raiv and may have pushed KMD to pull a desperate fake claim seeing that the rest of the town was heading in that direction.

His crumb was hilarious. HIV Positive. lol.

Why did Zaz replace!!!??? I STILL don't understand that.

One thing that totally lost KMD was that he forgot to explain that scum would obviously know if there wasn't a cop (given the setup). This is something I love about newbie games, that you can rule out setups. I believe I went through this in my first post of day 2.

[alexhans]

Oh, and I faked the breadcrumb. It never existed. I looked at my first post of the day and googled it. That movie was the first thing to come up, so I turned it into a fake breadcrumb. Last minute desperation thing.

I told you it looked fake. HIV positive... You could've come up with something better... lol.

Alex, we didn't have a QT, but I can dig out PMs if you want them. Not tonight though. I'm getting tired.

When and IF you can buddy. I just love to see what are the thought processes of scum and completing my view of the game.

I don't think you played such a bad game. You should continue IC-ing. The only non-IC thing you did was stating that both IC's couldn't be scum together. But the IC wiki says that if you misdirect newbies as scum you can explain it in the endgame, what's the supposed way in wich things are done and that's it.

Really. You could've won. Replacements screwed you big time.

She replaced out for personal reasons that I'd rather not go into.

I'll stop asking about Zaz then.

Alex, you mostly played well and made good decisions. Try not to be too easily influenced in the future though. The person whose reasoning sounds the most solid can very easily be scum who is good with words.

I'll try. This is why I'm always afraid of logical pro town players... like you and Zaz. What if they're scum?

[alexhans]

No, everything helped. I was all for lynching Raivann. I just wanted to be covered up in case he wasn't scum. Have info for tomorrow.

Seeing that now we couldn't be accused of defending our scumbuddies I wanted to defend a little some players so I could see if someone was pushing a case too hard.

GG Knox. Thanks for replacing in!